To say Nicolas Winding Refn is interesting would be a major understatement. Refn oozes with brilliance. Ironically, he’s quite similar to the films he makes. Refn talks in an existential manor almost to the point of poetry. I’d be lying if I said I could take in everything he was saying, but like his films, the more you think about what he’s trying to get across the more you understand. Refn is unlike any other director out there in terms of the films he makes and the way he describes them. It’s impossible not to feel fully engaged in every word that comes out of his mouth.
Refn is currently out promoting his latest and best film yet, Valhalla Rising. It’s a change of pace from his previous cult hit Bronson, but that’s what he’s interested in. Refn never wants to repeat himself and he even said he’d go as far as making a romantic comedy to a musical to remain unpredictable. While Refn and I mostly talked about his genre bending Viking film, we did dive into the diversity of his films, the reoccurring themes of his work, and Refn even discussed why Pretty Woman (yes, the Julia Roberts prostitute romance romp) is the darkest film he’s ever seen. So yes, Refn had plenty of interesting things to say.
Note: Apologies for the slight choppy nature of this interview. My recorder faded in and out quite a bit so not all of the interview is here.
Valhalla Rising really is a collage of different genres from a western, to a samurai film, to even an action film, but how exactly would you describe it?
Valhalla Rising is a fusion of my upbringing, basically. Everything I grew up loving and wanted to make a film of. There’s the samurai, there’s the western, there’s the spaghetti western, there’s a sci-fi movie, a drug movie, there’s Snake Plissken, there’s Trakovsky, Herzog, Kubrick, and Malick. It’s just one big fusion of everything I grew up on.
You’ve said before how films take on a life of their own, how does Valhalla Rising differ from how you originally envisioned it?
I think that the ambitions thematically the film grew so much from what I originally thought. I originally thought I was going to make a full-on action movie the way I did the Pusher movies: all handheld, gritty, and in your face Viking stuff. As it progressed, it really was what I wanted to make. I thought I wanted to make that, but thank god I didn’t.
Does that happen when you’re writing the script or throughout the whole process?
No. It happens from my original idea to script to when we start shooting. Everything has an influence. Also, because I shoot in chronological order it’s sort of a normal evolution.
That must be a pretty big benefit.
Yeah. It’s like Bronson became an autobiography of my own life because of that. So automatically it’s a different kind of approach to things. That’s also why after Valhalla Rising I felt, “Well, probably now it’s time to do a film in Hollywood and to do something so completely different than that movie.”
With Valhalla Rising, you also said you really wanted to trust your instincts instead of working in conventional terms. Is that your first time doing that, or have you done that as well on your past films?
I think I do that all the time, but it’s just something I say every time (laughs).
Could you say why you find that more beneficial over say, always sticking with a plan?
It’s a preference, really. Certain people like to plan out everything in advance and I guess I was more into that when I was younger. For me, I’m more interested in the process of that process than anything else. So I like to take things as they come. In a way, through that, you learn or you figure out I would say why you’re not doing it differently. So whatever turns out to be the way you do it in the end is the right way. I always thought, “I don’t know what I want, but that I just know what I don’t want.”
Has your process always been like that?
Always, but I became more aware of it when I started Pusher two and three. That was the second phase of my life.
Like Bronson, Valhalla Rising really has a heightened reality where it becomes very surreal. Why does that interest you more than say straight realism now?
Well, I’d say the Pusher trilogy was all about being real and to the extent where I was casting real gangsters almost playing themselves. That worked very well for those kind of films and certainly for that. Just like how they were shot all handheld blah, blah, blah. The reason, I’ve always wanted to try different kinds of languages and it just speaks to me more. Also, I just like to do different kinds of films.
And what about men of violence? You do follow very violent characters.
Yeah, I know. That’s what my mother always says…
Interview continues on the next page…